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RE: TT course knowledge - SILJA - 07-07-2015
I don't get what you write. The Bus Station is mentioned on the thread after Albert Road. Above the map there's a note that the Bus Station isn't on the map because lack of space. Please read once more!
RE: TT course knowledge - Ackerman - 07-07-2015
Ah ok, I see, I'm new to your doc.
RE: TT course knowledge - SILJA - 26-10-2015
The links to the virtual images at TT course knowledge are deleted. The reason why, is that the web page where the images were in stock has disappeared. Now someone else uses the URL to the page and it's about something else. Sorry for that. Can't find Andrew Reid who created the page with the virtual images and ask what has happened. I leave the TT course knowledge as it is now for the moment and maybe one day the virtual images will come back.
RE: TT course knowledge - SILJA - 30-12-2015
I'm reading Paul Bradford's excellent book Isle of Man TT & MGP Memorial 1907 - 2007 at the moment. On page 98 there's a report about John Wetherall's fatal accident 1970 that I witnessed. 1970 was my first visit in Isle of man and I don't remember all details nowadays. As far as I remember the crash happened not very far before Schoolhouse Corner in Ramsey. In the book Mr. Bradford writes about a corner called Miltown Corner after the 22nd milemark. At the moment Miltown Corner isn't mentioned in the "TT course knowledge" and now I have a question.
In the book it's written about a right hander just after a small bridge. Is that the right hander after Glen Auldyn Bridge that at the moment is named Gardener's Lane Junction? Is that the same spot that Mr. Bradford has named Miltown Corner? Or is it at some other spot in the Milntown area? I know that Glen Auldyn Bridge as well is called Milntown Bridge and that fact make me think that Miltown Corner is the same spot as the right hander at Gardener's Lane Junction. Right or wrong?
RE: TT course knowledge - peter - 30-12-2015
You are Right in your conclusions
RE: TT course knowledge - DBD 34 - 31-12-2015
Milntown Corner was always the right hander before Glen Auldyn.
RE: TT course knowledge - SILJA - 31-12-2015
Hmm...does that mean the right hander at The Caravan or the right hander that is the right hander at the right and left hander at Pinfold or Miltown Cottage? Can you be more precise, please?
RE: TT course knowledge - DBD 34 - 01-01-2016
Hi Silja, if you look at first picture on page 2 that is Milntown. Hope that clarifies.
RE: TT course knowledge - SILJA - 01-01-2016
(01-01-2016, 12:16 AM)DBD 34 Wrote: Hi Silja, if you look at first picture on page 2 that is Milntown. Hope that clarifies.
Hi DBD 34 and thank you for your information!
Your information makes me a little puzzeled. I remember that when I witnessed John Wetherall's fatal accident in 1970 I was sitting on a stone wall on the left side of the course. There is no stone wall before the right hander at Miltown Cottage that you say is Miltown Corner. Maybe Paul Bradford isn't accurate in his book? He writes that the accident happened in the right hander known as Milntown Corner. Though there's a stone wall on the left both before The Caravan and the right hander directly after Glen Auldyn Bridge. Where we are at this moment there is a new question: Where happened John Wetherall's fatal accident in 1970? What's the naming of that spot and is it correct that Miltown Corner is at Milntown Cottage? More help needed!
RE: TT course knowledge - SILJA - 02-01-2016
Latest information about John Wetherall's fatal accident 1970. The crash happened in the right hander after the jump after Glen Auldyn Bridge, and some yards later, Gardener's Lane Junction. The information comes from a rider who competed in that race. But there's no information about that this corner is called Miltown Corner. Maybe Paul Bradford isn't accurate in the book and that DBD 34 is correct about that Miltown Corner is at Miltown Cottage. Before I publish the information at the TT course knowledge I'm grateful for more knowledge, please!
RE: TT course knowledge - SILJA - 02-01-2016
I've googled for "Milntown Corner" and that shows that it is the right hander where John Wetherall's fatal accident 1970 happened. The right just after Gardener's Lane Junction.
OK I know that Google isn't true always but it's a hint! Grateful for more info!
RE: TT course knowledge - DBD 34 - 02-01-2016
Hi Silja, my Dad raced here from 1950 to 1960 and always taught me the names of all of the corners at the time, nowadays people are adding their own tilt on things, such as "Conker Fields" I can see the thinking behind this as the trees on the right hand side of the course produced some of the toughest conkers on the island but back in the day this stretch was called Churchtown. We should never dilute the history of the course names and let people rename them.
RE: TT course knowledge - SILJA - 03-01-2016
Hi DBD 34, I agree with you about the change of history but the process has started since many years and I'm not the man to stop it. To help people nowadays to get oriented around the course I believe that it's necessary to mention the old and the new names to not create a total chaos. It would be a step backwards to not mention new names and a result should be more places without any name at all. That's why I put such an effort on the TT course knowledge.
Can all readers of this thread together sort out where the corner called Milntown Corner is? At the moment we have to suggestions. At Milntown or Pinfold Cottage and just after Gardener's Lane Junction. As I see it, it's more likely that it is the last of the two suggestions. More help needed!
RE: TT course knowledge - Splashdown - 04-01-2016
I understand DBD34's urge to keep traditional names. However, I should point out that we have been changing names of vantage points throughout the history of the TT. I do not necessarily agree with some of the changes. I agree with DBD34 re "Conker trees", it WAS "Churchtown". I believe it was legendary MGP rider Joe Thornton who painted the "K" on the trees in the late 60s.
Good examples of name changes that have stuck over the years are: "Guthrie's", which was "The Cutting" and "Greeba Castle", which was "Hall Caine's".
I do believe that "Milntown Cottage" was part of a sequence called "The Lezayre Bends" long ago.
"The Black Hut", was called "Stonebreaker's Hut", and the "East Mountain Box" was called "The East Snaefell Gate".
"Kate's Cottage" (actually Tate's), is in fact the location for "Keppel Gate" pre 1st World War.
If I get my pre-WW1 copies of "The Motor Cycle" out, I am sure I will find you a few more.
There are quite a few names changes I will never be using, among them, "Dukes" for the "32nd", "Milky's" for "Ballaspur", and "Joey's" for the "26th Milestone". No offence to those riders.
The facts are that time and people move on, and changes WILL occur. The more frequently riders, spectators, and marshals use the new names, the sooner they will become adopted.
RE: TT course knowledge - Alfie Noakes - 04-01-2016
Milntown corner for me was the right(which leads the run to Schoolhouse) after the jump/bridge, "Milntown" section for me was where the cottage/house is with reflective memories for me as this is where Mick Lofthouse lost his life, I don't recall anybody ever calling or telling me Milntown was the left before the cottage appears, me and mates used to call that left Sky Hill - only because at the time there was a big sign advertising Sky Hill Pony Trekking on the right hand side approach - just adding my own little memories/info here not stating anything.
RE: TT course knowledge - theton58 - 04-01-2016
Completely agree with DBD 34. We shouldn't be adopting new names "willy nilly". Also agree with Splashdown (who is saying the same thing I think) that new names will ((and should) stick. The key is that they should be appropriate and somehow be and feel right. The TT is full of tradition and history and that should never be lost or diluted.
Please dig out your old Motor Cycles Splashdown and give us some more examples.
RE: TT course knowledge - SILJA - 04-01-2016
Which means that all new names should be deleted? What is new? Where is the border? All new names after 1970, 1950, 1930???
RE: TT course knowledge - Splashdown - 05-01-2016
Back to the Milntown Cottage issue. The name was used in 1963 when Tony Godfrey crashed there in the 250 race, and was the first person picked up by helicopter.
I have always used "Milntown" as the actual cottage, the white one on the left hand side on the right hander. The next right after the "Glen Audlyn" jump, has always been known (in my circles) as the "right hander after Glen Audlyn".
The left hander before Milntown has of late been known as "Sky Hill", as Alfie Noakes correctly states, but I don't know for how long this name has been used.
I'll have to do a bit of work to see when "Milntown Cottage was first used, but I have never read of it in any pre WW2 reports.
RE: TT course knowledge - SILJA - 05-01-2016
I have Sky Hill with another spelling. Skye Hill. Correct or not?
RE: TT course knowledge - DBD 34 - 05-01-2016
Sky Hill is the correct spelling.
Thanks Splashdown for your input on the Milntown query, that ties in exactly with my thinking also.
The righthander after Glen Auldyn has recently become known as Gardeners Lane and I think that will probably stick now.